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https://browsersl.ist/#q=defaults%2C+not+op_mini+all%2C+not+dead%2C+Firefox+ESR%2C+baseline+widely+available

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baseline widely available versions of Chrome, Edge, Firefox, and Safari supports the current Baseline Widely available set of features, which have been interoperable in those browsers for at least 30 months.

@skjnldsv skjnldsv requested review from ShGKme and susnux October 17, 2025 08:00
@skjnldsv skjnldsv self-assigned this Oct 17, 2025
@skjnldsv skjnldsv force-pushed the skjnldsv-patch-1 branch 4 times, most recently from be4c1d2 to 7c4961b Compare October 17, 2025 08:16
@skjnldsv
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Added tests to make sure our systems are compatible
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@skjnldsv skjnldsv merged commit a7054ab into main Oct 17, 2025
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@skjnldsv skjnldsv deleted the skjnldsv-patch-1 branch October 17, 2025 08:20
This was referenced Oct 17, 2025
@ShGKme
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ShGKme commented Oct 23, 2025

The new configuration requires support for much older browsers than the previous one, resulting in a large bundle size.

@skjnldsv Could you confirm, this was intended?

BeforeAfter

and_chr >=132
and_ff >=132
and_uc >=15.5
android >=132
chrome >=109
edge >=131
firefox >=128
ios_saf >=15.6
op_mob >=80
opera >=114
safari >=17.6
samsung >=27

and_chr >=141
and_ff >=143
and_qq >=14.9
and_uc >=15.5
android >=141
chrome >=109
edge >=111
firefox >=112
ios_saf >=16.4
kaios >=2.5
op_mob >=80
opera >=121
safari >=16.4
samsung >=27

@skjnldsv
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The new configuration requires support for much older browsers

Kind of I guess?
As long as we ensure baseline widely available is supported, that was really the main concerns when establishing that login check (indirectly)

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ShGKme commented Oct 23, 2025

Browser Before After Change
and_chr 132 141 increased
and_ff 132 143 increased
and_qq - 14.9 added
and_uc 15.5 15.5 unchanged
android 132 141 increased
chrome 109 109 unchanged
edge 131 111 ⚠️ decreased
firefox 128 112 ⚠️ decreased
ios_saf 15.6 16.4 increased
kaios - 2.5 added
op_mob 80 80 unchanged
opera 114 121 increased
safari 17.6 16.4 ⚠️ decreased
samsung 27 27 unchanged

@skjnldsv
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Ok from me 👍

@susnux
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susnux commented Oct 24, 2025

Firefox, Edge and Chrome are the problem there because of old versions, there it should be probably last 5 majors max.

Ideally we have a crafted list per Nextcloud release, because that list above is not what we support officially, its missing iOS 15.
So its currently a regression compared to what we promise to support in that regard.

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susnux commented Oct 24, 2025

So for our current promises about supported platforms the query would probably look like:

baseline widely available and last 4 major versions and not dead, firefox esr, ios 15.6

  • baseline widely available and last 4 major versions and not dead firefox, chrome, safari with features available for 30+ month but only the last 4 versions
  • firefox esr for enterprise
  • ios 15.6 as we still support ios 15

But to keep also the support for more used browsers I guess a bit longer query like this makes sense:
https://browsersl.ist/#q=baseline+widely+available+with+downstream+and+last+4+major+versions+and+not+dead%0Abaseline+widely+available+with+downstream+and+%3E0.25%25+and+not+dead%0Afirefox+esr%0Aios+15.8

@skjnldsv
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"ios 15.6" seems like a bad idea, as we'll have to maintain that number

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susnux commented Oct 27, 2025

"ios 15.6" seems like a bad idea, as we'll have to maintain that number

ah sorry I was wrong, we updated to 16+ so its probably https://browsersl.ist/#q=baseline+widely+available+with+downstream+and+last+4+major+versions+and+not+dead%0Abaseline+widely+available+with+downstream+and+%3E0.25%25+and+not+dead%0Afirefox+esr


The problem with the current one is in my opinion that it adds some browsers that do NOT support baseline widely available that add a lot of bundle size.

This happens because of the defaults added as an OR instead of an AND.
So everything from default is added additionally and not in conjunction with baseline available.

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ShGKme commented Oct 27, 2025

Another note: baseline query is not supported by browserslist-rs, used by:

  • Lightning CSS (built-in in Vite and RSPack)
  • SWC (built-in in RSPack)

See:

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susnux commented Oct 27, 2025

We transform browserslist manually to esbuild compatible targets in the vite config, so supported bundlers Webpack and Vite should be good for now.

But this also affects oxc and thus rolldown-vite for the future (yet it still supports the esbuild targets so its working currently): https://github.com/oxc-project/oxc-browserslist

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ShGKme commented Oct 27, 2025

We transform browserslist manually to esbuild compatible targets in the vite config, so supported bundlers Webpack and Vite should be good for now.

Until we minimise CSS.

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susnux commented Oct 27, 2025

Until we minimise CSS.

But it also takes esbuild browser targets as per config

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ShGKme commented Oct 27, 2025

But it also takes esbuild browser targets as per config

ES version target doesn't properly reflect CSS optimisations...

That's why we have a complete browserslist config and not just a single ES year.

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susnux commented Oct 27, 2025

ES version target doesn't properly reflect CSS optimisations...

I do not talk about ES version but ESBuild targets: https://esbuild.github.io/api/#target
Like chrome58,edge16,firefox57 and similar.
Which is the same as https://vite.dev/config/build-options.html#build-target

We transform browserslist to esbuild to configure it explicitly.

@skjnldsv
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Why do I feel like you two are going far too deep into that topic... 🙈

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4 participants